New guy got a PUMA M92 - Too long a story?

The Rossi Model R92, a lightweight carbine for Cowboy Action, hunting, or plinking! Includes Rossi manufactured Interarms, Navy Arms, and Puma trade names.
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New guy got a PUMA M92 - Too long a story?

Post by Gunny268 »

For 30 years I’ve been reloading for my Blackhawks in .357 and .45 Colt. But, thank you very much, those July and November 2018 covers of the Dillon Blue Press got me interested in a carbine sized (16” barreled) lever gun. I’m sure some of you are familiar with what’s next. Yea, I got “that itch” for a particular “new gun.”
So, for the next couple of weeks I went around to some of the not so local gun shops looking to scratch that itch. No one had any lever action carbines of any make, and the price for a special order was way out of reach for the likes of me. I also went to a couple of gun shows and prowled around the tables to see what I could find. A couple of vendors introduced me to their “Rossi/Braztech R92” rifles. No carbines were to be had, and prices were about as high as the Marlins and Henrys in the gun shops. Time for “Plan B” - the Internet.
Lucky for me, I stumbled across this forum. God Bless you RD. It is, without a doubt, a gold mine of information. And you folks, The Members, are definitely the real deal.
I eventually came around to this kinda muddled way of thinking. And, if I’m off base on this, then its strictly on me. Also, I’m not afraid to get better educated. A “Rossi/Braztech R92” is likely a hit or miss as far as being within spec to tolerances. Generally, the earlier manufactured models – the “Rossi PUMA M92” was considered to be more consistent in reliability (tolerances?), so that became my goal.
I began to lurk the internet sales sites and eventually a PUMA M92 (.357 mag) with 16” barrel and ¾ sized large loop lever popped up on GunBroker. A penny auction start, now at $280.00 with 8 bids.
Now bear with me on this part. It was a Thursday afternoon and the next three days for me (Fri, Sat, & Sun) were going to be duty days. That’s three Day Shifts (12 hours each) in a patrol car for a city just shy of 75,000. So, being interested in that particular carbine, I plugged in my bid and logged out.
Friday and Saturday were pretty much the non-stop “weekend craziness” for a city this size. But, Sunday was unusually quiet. That afternoon, being free from any service calls, I decided to go along with one of my patrolmen to “foot patrol” the gun show at the City's Events Center.
There I found a guy selling a Rossi 92 carbine for $500.00. I went up to his table and told him I was looking for a .357 lever gun. He handed me the Rossi and told me that he had his FFL and was selling it for a buddy. It was a Rossi Puma M92 16 in. carbine in .45 Colt, ¾ sized large loop lever, imported by LSI. Fireworks started going off in my head, but I kept my poker face and stated that 45 Colt ammo was currently going for $45.00 a box. That it would be very expensive to keep feeding a gun in that caliber. I then repeated that I was looking for a 357, turned, and walked away.
About an hour later, as we circled back around by his table, he called me over and sweetened the deal by offering two boxes of ammo to go along with the carbine. I borrowed a couple of 45 Colt snap caps, function checked and inspected it. It passed, so we did the deal. I left there with the carbine, two boxes of factory ammo, and in what some might call, a pretty good mood.
I spent my next two days off (Mon. and Tues) going through a complete disassembly and cleaning of that carbine. On my range, at about 65 paces, I was shooting clover leafs (with an occasional flyer) on paper targets.
Honestly, I’ve developed quite an affection for this Little Kate. And I fully expected it to be my go to gun for scratching that itch for quite a while.
Silly me.
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Re: New guy got a PUMA M92 - Too long a story?

Post by Nashville Stage »

Congrats on the find, and welcome to the forum! It sounds like your carbine is already serving you well.
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Re: New guy got a PUMA M92 - Too long a story?

Post by Archer »

Gunny268 wrote:...the internet sales sites and eventually a PUMA M92 (.357 mag) with 16” barrel and ¾ sized large loop lever popped up on GunBroker. A penny auction start, now at $280.00 with 8 bids.
Now bear with me on this part. It was a Thursday afternoon and the next three days for me (Fri, Sat, & Sun) were going to be duty days. That’s three Day Shifts (12 hours each) in a patrol car for a city just shy of 75,000. So, being interested in that particular carbine, I plugged in my bid and logged out.
So, I don't see any follow up on the auction, is there any more to this part of the story?

Congrats on the .45 Colt. Glad it is working out well.

If you reload .45 Colt is a good caliber to roll your own ammo with. Most factory ammo will be mild and as you noted a bit expensive. You can duplicate those mild loads or potentially load warmer since the 92 action will typically handle higher pressures IF and ONLY if you aren't going to mix up those rounds and put them in a lesser gun not made for the extra pressure. While you are at it you can offset the cost for the reloading equipment with the difference in cost between what you assemble yourself vs. factory ammo. IF you can't follow a cookbook recipe do NOT get into reloading.
Last edited by Archer on 16 Apr 2020 12:29, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New guy got a PUMA M92 - Too long a story?

Post by Nashville Stage »

Archer wrote:
Nashville Stage wrote:...the internet sales sites and eventually a PUMA ...
Hey Archer, I didn't write that; Gunny268 did.
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Re: New guy got a PUMA M92 - Too long a story?

Post by Archer »

Nashville Stage wrote:
Archer wrote:
Nashville Stage wrote:...the internet sales sites and eventually a PUMA ...
Hey Archer, I didn't write that; Gunny268 did.
I KNEW that but did screw it up when I went to copy the name for the quote.
I'll FIX it!
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Re: New guy got a PUMA M92 - Too long a story?

Post by Archer »

A note on 'carbines'

In ancient times when the 1860 Henry, the 1866 Winchester, the 1873 Winchester and the Spencer came out most 'rifles' were single shot muzzle loaders that weighed quite a bit and had barrels that were often 28 or 30 inches long.
The lever actions mimicked the style of the time and rifles were typically 26"to 30".
Carbines for the time wore 20" or 22" barrels. It was rare for a long arm to have anything shorter although there were exceptions usually one of creations by individual gunsmiths to cut down factory rifles.

Running into WWI barrel lengths for bolt action rifles tended to run from 30" or so down to about 24" depending on the model and country of use. The trend toward shorter barrels had started. By WWII even if a country was still using longer barreled rifles they typically had a 'carbine' version that was somewhere between 18" and 24" or in the case of the U.S. carbines were specific 18" barreled weapons that essentially fired a pistol cartridge. After WWII the trend continued, the U.S. M1 Garand at 24" was replaced with the M14 at 22" and then the AR-15/M-16 series weapons with 20" barrels. The M4 'carbine' variant dropped the barrel length to 14.5". The Russian Mosin-Nagant rifles at 29" had already spawned carbines at 20". Russia went to the SKS at 20" and later AK series guns at just about 16". Due to ATF regulations civilian rifles in the U.S. are restricted to barrels at least 16" long leading to a lot of pseudo M4 style guns with 16" barrels or 14.5" barrels extended by 1.5" muzzle devices that are pinned and welded in place to meet minimum length requirements.

When I was buying my first lever action, first firearm in fact, Winchester had produced mostly 20" carbines for 60 years or more and called them 'rifles'. Carbine was not mentioned anywhere I recall on the box, manual or any of the advertising of the time.

Rossi has produced what they term 'rifles' which are typically 20" and 24" octagonal barreled guns with a crescent buttplate. They also produce using the same action 'carbines' with 16" and 20" barrels fitted with round barrels and a curved buttplate without the corner points of the crescent ones that wrapped around the top of the stock. There are a few other differences including the rifle has a fore end cap while the carbine stock may be a slight bit shorter length of pull.

My point is there's really no strict definition to 'carbine' with regards to barrel length. The word simply means 'short rifle' and the definition of 'short' varies with the model of weapon and the styles of the time. The Braztech 'rifles' Gunny268 walked away from may well have been a 20" 'carbine' like a couple I own.
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Re: New guy got a PUMA M92 - Too long a story?

Post by Gunny268 »

Hey Archer, you are right on the money. Perhaps I should have used the term referencing Winchester's "Trapper" length?
Anyway, much to my surprise I got the email the following Thursday that I had won the auction and to make contact with the seller for payment and shipping FFL info. That was done, and now I am very happy to have a Rossi in .45 Colt and another in .357/.38. Both are firing flawlessly with factory and my reloads (for .45 Colt Bisley and .357 Blackhawk).
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When the weather clears I want to group and chronograph some factory 125 gr. Remington .357 ammo. I'm interested in the velocity and accuracy differences between the Rossi and my .357 Blackhawk.
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Re: New guy got a PUMA M92 - Too long a story?

Post by Archer »

The only problem, if it is a problem, is those are almost identical from across the room.
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Re: New guy got a PUMA M92 - Too long a story?

Post by Ranch Dog »

Archer wrote:The only problem, if it is a problem, is those are almost identical from across the room.
I've got five that look the same, but just like quintuplets, daddy can tell them apart from across the room. ;)

Nice rifles Gunny, I enjoyed the story and thank you for your service!
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Re: New guy got a PUMA M92 - Too long a story?

Post by josef644 »

The 'tang' photo looks stainless.
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