Can't insert last round. File down Loading gate?

[zippy]

I had loading problems with my .357 92. Two things eliminated them.

1. Well crimped ammo cases, with as close to a smooth case mouth transition as possible.

Followed Steve's Gunz advice on his DVD, and relieved the loading gate spring pressure by grinding the rectangular flat spring into a slightly hourglass shaped profile.

Good luck

[Fran49829]

Cleaning the mag tube did not help. Even with the mag spring and follower removed I still had the same problem. Thanks for your help. I plan to try zippy's fix and file or grind down the gate spring.

[Nashville Stage]

Hello,
The last round hangs up on the receiver and no amount of my finger pressure will get it all the way in. If I push down on the loading gate with a small screwdriver I can get the round in. It seems like the loading gate spring is to stiff.

Yes, the tension on the loading gate can be rather high from the factory. The spring for that is a leaf spring that's just behind the gate and is integral to the gate. You can disassemble the receiver, remove the loading gate, and grind/remove some material from the leaf spring to lighten the tension there.

Another thing you can do is round over the sharp edge where the cartridge goes through the receiver (the place where the rim of the cartridge in your photo is hung up on). When you have the receiver disassembled and the loading gate removed, use a small flat file to remove the sharp edge on the inside edge of the opening. Make sure to remove material from the edge that can't be seen when the gate is closed, not the edge that's visible on the outside.

An excellent tutorial on how to to this (and more) are in the DVD that Steves Gunz made. It's available from his shop, and is well worth the price in my opinion. Go to stevesgunz.com. While you're there, go ahead and order a reduced power spring for the ejector; the factory spring is way too strong, and tends to break ejectors (which are nearly impossible to get replacements for).

If you don't want to open up the receiver or remove any material, a simpler way of easing the problem is to use one additional cartridge to just push the rim of the last cartridge past the point where it hangs up and into the magazine.

[Nashville Stage]

Oh, there's one last thing that might help a little, but I wouldn't do it until after you've tried the previous recommendations.

The magazine spring tends to be a little long (it's sized to work for the longest barrels, yet the shorter barrels get the same spring). You didn't mention what length barrel your rifle has, but you could trim a little length off the spring to lighten the tension when pushing rounds into the magazine, particularly when the magazine is almost full.

I can't remember what the recommended length is, but I know it's in the DVD as well. If you accidentally cut the magazine spring too short, you'll have problems cycling the last round from the magazine into the chamber. However, replacement magazine springs are easy to get.

[Heffe3434]

I had the same problem with my 16" barrel 92. I could load 2 or three rounds and then the rest were next to impossible to load. I cut the length of three, 357 cases off of the magazine spring (read about it here or another forum) and it solved my problem. I can load to full capacity with no problems and with no feeding issues.

[Archer]

Goto my third post below this one and read that first.

Are you getting the rear of the cartridge inserted far enough to the LEFT of the receiver that the rim clears the loading opening? IF SO then you do not need to relieve the loading gate spring tension. The picture shows the rim resting on the edge of the loading hole.

Check the mag tube for burrs.

I hear a LOT of people say to thin the loading gate spring but unless it is VERY stout it simply should not cause problems. Likewise the spring force from the magazine spring should be easy enough to overcome with a little more push force on the cartridge.

If this is jamming HARD it is more likely that there is a problem with the round catching on an edge or a burr or the follower for the magazine spring being swelled and sticking or some other part jamming the case or the gate.

That round is far enough in that it should not be an angle problem with it (assuming you can push that rim LEFT of the right hand portion of the frame) but it could still be catching on an edge on the gun.

[Archer]

Goto my second post below this one and read that first.

Cleaning the mag tube did not help. Even with the mag spring and follower removed I still had the same problem. Thanks for your help. I plan to try zippy's fix and file or grind down the gate spring.

So if you are having the same exact problem without the mag spring installed then the mag spring length isn't the problem in the subject line.

This happens even if I am only loading 1 catridge.

So the topic title is this is with the last round and the statement above is it happens with a single round being inserted into the gun...

The way I read this is that you are having problems getting the last round you want to put into the gun past the loading gate no matter how many rounds you are inserting? Is that the case?

How are you loading the gun?
By this I mean are you loading the round partly through the loading gate and then shoving it on through with the next round you want to load?
OR
Are you shoving each round FULLY into the magazine past the loading gate and then depressing the closed gate with the nose of the next round to start it into the magazine?

The gun SHOULD be capable of being loaded EITHER way but if you are loading the first way then the LAST round is the only one you have to push FULLY into the magazine manually without the 'tool' of the next round in line. The only difference at that point is that you have to get the last little bit of the round in the mag with your finger instead of the next round. From the picture that round has to move a little left to clear the rim from the frame and then forward past the edge of the gate. (Reference directions from the shooter's position with the gun in a shooting position.)

What size fingers do you have? The .357 Rossi has a small loading gate and that can be a little bit of a challenge for large or broad fingers.

How many rounds have you been able to get in the gun?
How many rounds is the gun supposed to hold? (OR how long is the barrel?) Both my .357 and my .44 Mag with 20" barrels hold 10 rounds. My 24" .44 Mag holds 12 rounds.
You say this happens with 1 to 5 rounds, have you tried to get more rounds into the gun?

BTW, just as a caution, dummy rounds or snap caps are probably a good idea when fiddling with the gun at home but snap caps (in particular .38 SP Azoom) may not be EXACT dimensions of an actual round and may not always act like a real round during feeding exercises. Also the Rossi can chew up snap caps pretty well over time.

[Archer]

BTW, IF you choose to modify the loading gate spring...
Follow Zippy's advice and Steves Gunz pattern to 'hour glass' the spring with a gradual transition. You do not want to notch the spring abruptly unless you want to create a fatigue point that will eventually break. Further if you use a grinder take care to go reasonably slow and to keep the part cool enough to touch so you don't remove the spring temper from it.

From what you said, in order to allow the last round to back out of the gun you have to depress the loading gate with a screwdriver?
I sort of doubt that's just a function of the gate spring tension alone. It could be a combination of the gate spring tension and a sharp edge on the frame or gate preventing the round from moving.

Can you press the gate into the receiver with your finger?
Can you press the gate any deeper into the receiver with the cartridge in the position shown in the picture?

READ THE NEXT POST BEFORE DOING ANY MODS.

[Archer]

I think Ranch Dog's last comment may be valid.
The gate looks like it is hanging up on the bottom edge. It appears more open at the top than the bottom.
If there's packing grease/wax in the gun under the lifter that could well be the problem.

None of my 3 Braztech guns were overly packed with that goop. I did wipe out a thin coating of it just about everywhere but the guy who ladles it one might have been sick when mine left the factory. I have seen guns come into the shop with a lot more of it in them though. RD's comment that he uses 3 cans of carb cleaner on a new Rossi should tell you that sometimes these guns come into the U.S. with a heck of a lot of gummy waxy grease in them that does not remove easily. The break in procedure where you clean and lubricate the gun followed by cycling it and then repeating the cleaning and lubrication is also excellent advice. I wouldn't dry fire it during that exercise but you can let the hammer down manually each cycle. I went through that with all 3 of my Rossi 92s.

I second the non-chlorinated carb cleaner. You could also use Kerosene as a solvent in a pinch but it has it's own problems. I would NOT use WD-40 as it tends to dry to a varnish and lock things up. DO pull the stock and forearm as the carb cleaner and most of the solvents will damage the finish of the wood.

Try the solvent before grinding on the gun.

[Ranch Dog]

I wouldn't dry fire it during that exercise but you can let the hammer down manually each cycle.

Yes, what Archer added.

I've done a lot of work to my rifles, where needed, but never before they have been cleaned through the outlined cycle. You can not possibly know what it really needs until the Alox has been flushed out of it.