Reloading Win296 for R92 in 357

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oldschool45
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Reloading Win296 for R92 in 357

Post by oldschool45 »

I understand that the original 1892 had a pretty stout action. None of John Browning's guns that were designed in the age of blackpowder needed to be reworked for smokeless powders. So an R92 with modern steel should be fairly robust.
I've done a fair bit of reloading and I've done a few things with 45ACP that aren't in any books like launching 255gr 45LC bullets from a 1911.
I won't ask for any recipes for over book loads but I will probably ladder load in .2 increments up from there on my own. Mainly 125gr & 158gr plated and XTP's
I'm not planning do do any proof testing but any hints to how far I can push these with Win296? Or an alternative powder when they become available again?
Thanks,
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Re: Reloading Win296 for R92 in 357

Post by Archer »

Most of the black powder cartridges that made the transition to smokeless are held to pressure levels that approximate the black powder levels. Quite often when they raised the pressure levels they redesigned the cartridge just enough to make it where it would not chamber in the previous guns. The 92 was designed was a strong action that was more capable than most of the black powder calibers of the time. There was at least for a time a .44-40 high pressure loading specifically labeled and marketed for the 92 only.

For what it is worth Buffalo Bore +P loads in .45 Colt generally list 'the Winchester 92 all variants and copies' BUT I did not check all of their offerings to verify this was true in EVERY type they offer. Garrett Cartridges on the other hand lists the Rossi 92 specifically for SOME but NOT all of their +P .45 Colt ammo.

AFAIK, any .45 Colt loads using Win 296 (or H110 for that matter) listed in any of the manuals are going to be listed as 'Ruger Blackhawk or TC Contender ONLY' loads.

I wanted the 92 design specifically because of the added strength of the design compared to say a Winchester 73 clone. It may be a slower action than the 73 but the 92 is slicker than the 94 and a whole lot stronger than the 73.

I don't load .45 Colt, so I don't have any favorite loads in either standard pressure or +P. I could dump you book loads from most manuals if you wanted.
There are guys on the site that stick to standard pressure loads and several that load them warm to hot that might chime in.
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Re: Reloading Win296 for R92 in 357

Post by GasGuzzler »

As to the .357 you can easily get over 1800 FPS with jacketed bullets and H110. It won't blow the rifle up but it will be hot.
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Re: Reloading Win296 for R92 in 357

Post by Archer »

Sorry I read the text without reading the .357 in the title and also missed the 125 gr and 158 gr as the bullet weights you were interested in.

Book info (Warning check this data with the manufactures for accuracy before use):
Hornady X edition manual: (Test rifle Rossi 92 16" barrel)
.357 Mag Rifle 158 grain jacketed bullet loads 1.590" COL, WSPM primer, Hornady case, Win 296 10.2 gr MIN Load @1200 FPS, 15.7 gr MAX Load @1650 FPS.

.357 Mag Rifle 125 grain jacketed bullet loads 1.590" COL, Win SPM primer, Hornady case, Win 296 11.8 gr MIN @1500 FPS, 20.0 gr MAX @2000 FPS.

Speer Manual #15 (18" test barrel length)
.357 Mag Rifle, 158 grain loads, JHP/JSP COL 1.570", Deep Curl COL 1.575", CCI 550 primer, Speer Case, Win 296 13.2 gr Min Load @1317 FPS, 14.7 Max Load @1557 FPS.

.357 Mag Rifle, 125 grain loads, GDHP COL 1.580", JHP 1.575", CCI 550 prime, Win 296 18.3 gr Min Load @1963 FPS, 23.0 gr Max Load (Compressed) @2167 FPS

Sierra V Edition Rifle data (Marlin 1894 18.5" barrel):
.357 Mag, 158 gr loads, JSP/JHP COL 1.585", Win 296 15.0 gr Min Load @1900 FPS, 17.0 gr Max Load @2100 FPS
.357 Mag, 125 gr loads, JSP/JHP COL 1.585", Win 296 18.0 gr Min Load @1600 FPS, 20.4 gr Max Load @ 1800 FPS.

Lyman 50th does not list 296 loads for .357 either in rifle or handgun sections for the 125 or 158 grain bullets.
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Re: Reloading Win296 for R92 in 357

Post by Archer »

This may also be of interest although it may be a bit dated at present:
https://www.leverguns.com/articles/paco ... rature.htm
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Re: Reloading Win296 for R92 in 357

Post by oldschool45 »

Archer thanks for the info I'll check that link later.
The picture is 158gr Hornady XTP over 16.7grains of Win296 with a CCI Mag Pistol primer
That load is off of various sites backed up by the Latest Lee Reloading manual.
I'm basically looking for an around 100 yard venison dinner and a 125gr load over 2000fps that would turn things into red mist.
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Re: Reloading Win296 for R92 in 357

Post by Archer »

That load you show is a duplicate of one listed on the link I posted.

I have Lee's first manual, but I didn't care for it much and it is in a back room right now. I may have to check his later version at some point.
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Re: Reloading Win296 for R92 in 357

Post by Ohio3Wheels »

In the big straight wall cases that I used to use H110 in I'm slowly switching over to Lil'Gun. With my loads I find it a bit more consistent and subjectively it seems to run cooler.

I haven't tried it in the 357 as yet, maybe this summer when it's easier to spend time at the range,

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Re: Reloading Win296 for R92 in 357

Post by ethang »

Ohio3Wheels wrote:In the big straight wall cases that I used to use H110 in I'm slowly switching over to Lil'Gun. With my loads I find it a bit more consistent and subjectively it seems to run cooler.

I haven't tried it in the 357 as yet, maybe this summer when it's easier to spend time at the range,

Make smoke,
I get less pressure signs in my 357(case head bulge) with Lil'gun vs 296, but have not found it to run cooler.. just the opposite. I have found it to burn very hot, heating the barrel up a good bit. It is pretty easy to get top speed with a 158 SP/HP with Lil'gun. For a hunting load I don't really care about the heat.

296/110 loads to get to the same velocity seems to bulge cases in my rifle, much more so than the lil'gun loads. I know in these trying times you load what you can find, so there is that.
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Re: Reloading Win296 for R92 in 357

Post by Archer »

I feel like I get good results out of 2400 for the .44 Mag having run over a thousand of them.

That said, I've got about ten pounds of H110 including a couple in the paper canisters. Somebody donated the unopened paper canisters when a shop I was dealing with decided to stop selling powder. Most of that lot I was trying to regift and didn't realize there was H110 in amongst it. Somebody was running a clearance sale at one of the gun shows and I picked up another six there. Picked it up partly because it was a good price and partly because I haven't seen a lot of 2400 in a while.

I think I've got a four pounder of Lil gun.

That batch of oddball powders also included a pound of IMR 4227

I've got 4 or 5 different calibers that use magnum handgun
powder.
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